tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post2074422722898932173..comments2023-05-07T04:15:06.213-07:00Comments on SF EdBlog: LOWELL HIGH SCHOOL AND THE DIVERSITY AGENDAAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comBlogger44125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-45509129749515101732013-11-21T01:16:12.710-08:002013-11-21T01:16:12.710-08:00Listen, no doubt we aren't doing a good enough...Listen, no doubt we aren't doing a good enough job educating our lowest performers, but the solution is not penalizing the high performers. It could create resentment and cause disincentives and negative attentions. I think we need to convince parents from a young age to arrange their life around their children's education ahead of all else. Many of these kids in the '60s and '70s could simply pay more attention and study more and take advantage of resources available to them they are ignoring. These kids who say math is too hard often spend 1500 hours a year watching TV and playing video games. Cry me a river lady! Take some responsibility!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-89287989579055758152013-11-20T20:53:05.312-08:002013-11-20T20:53:05.312-08:00I'd like to see a system where if a kid is at ...I'd like to see a system where if a kid is at 90-95%, they spend time volunteering to tutor kids in the' '60s and '70s before they spend more time studying to get an even higher score. Less greed, more cooperation, more altruism, more love. Maybe they could come up with a formula for how we can convince people to be less greedy and raise minimum wage instead of say I got mine, keep minimum wage low as we can! And cut my taxes on 200k so we can cut food stamps for people on a tenth that. It's disgusting!<br /><br />As for you people, when I die, when my time in this world is over, please bury me upside down so the people who wanted to fire me for caring about the poor can kiss my ass! <br /><br />Phooey on you people who want to make the rich even richer and the poor even poorer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-39834032009135241242013-11-20T20:11:55.713-08:002013-11-20T20:11:55.713-08:00The point, Don, is that she's a crackpot.The point, Don, is that she's a crackpot.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-52585360385107782782013-11-20T18:16:18.319-08:002013-11-20T18:16:18.319-08:004:16 -- I don't get your point. A student shou...4:16 -- I don't get your point. A student shouldn't do well, if another student can't do well? Is that your beef? No one can do well if everyone can't do well? How is that going to work? Explain what system you'd like to see rather than complaining about people who are only trying to do their best.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-70038207867136269272013-11-20T16:16:36.574-08:002013-11-20T16:16:36.574-08:00What if your child gets a pefect SAT score, what d...What if your child gets a pefect SAT score, what does that do to a child of a single parent who barely can eat, barely can read, has no prospects. You see where I'm going with this? What about racism? Poverty?<br /><br />Oh that doesn't matter, my precious son passed an AP Exam, and will be rich, whoopeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-40153482382821730272013-11-20T16:14:42.771-08:002013-11-20T16:14:42.771-08:00No, I don't know Wash and Lincoln honors and A...No, I don't know Wash and Lincoln honors and AP courses are worse than Lowell and neither do you. This is entirely presumptive on your part to say otherwise. If you think you can based such an assertion on the API of the school then you are even more clueless than you seem. Neither of us have any idea at all about the quality of the honors programs at those two schools. All you know is your beloved API score. <br /><br />I really feel that your kind of commentary is dragging down this blog. I didn't start this blog so I could spend my time correcting the responses of people who put words in my mouth because they can't read or think clearly.<br /><br />Wash and LIncoln for all we know may have much better teachers in their honors courses. Certainly you grasp the idea that API just tells you how kids do on average. It's pretty meaningless when it comes to individual stories. <br /><br />Be careful not to speak on my behalf. And I don't want to read a 1000 word essay on Stuyvesant. That has not one thing to do with the topic of this thread. WTF? I told you before. Go to your own blog if you can't follow the simple rules that even a child would understand.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-39446181304920440002013-11-20T15:26:59.075-08:002013-11-20T15:26:59.075-08:00Wash and Lincoln are terrible compared to Lowell, ...Wash and Lincoln are terrible compared to Lowell, your son would study 10-15 fewer hours a week and get 2-300 points lower on the SAT. Anything else is a fantasy and you know it, he wouldn't be as good a person at 18 if he'd done that. And every school I ever sent my kids to had 30% free and reduced lunch vs. 10-15% nationwide, so I did do that, you just don't recognize it, I'm forever wrong because I didn't drive to Hunter's Point twice a day even though you didn't either, I can never talk about equality unless I send them to a school in Hunter's Point or the Tenderloin, that's an all or nothing slippery slope approach I don't buy.<br /><br />If you have a disability it's a different matter. <br /><br />Stuyvesant in NYC lets in purely on test scores, is as big as Lowell, and geta 1408 as an average SAT score, 2112 on the new scale. That's phenomenal, even better than Lowell. Lowell could reach that if they used testing:<br /><br />Stuyvesant's foreign language offerings include Mandarin Chinese, French, German, Hebrew, Italian, Latin, Japanese, Korean, and Spanish. The school's Muslim Student Association raised funds to support courses in Arabic, which began in 2005.[45] Stuyvesant's Biology and Geo-science department offers courses in molecular biology (a course sequence composed of a molecular science class in the Fall and a molecular genetics class in the Spring), human physiology, medical ethics, medical and veterinary diagnosis, human disease, anthropology and sociobiology, vertebrate zoology, laboratory techniques, medical human genetics, botany, the molecular basis of cancer, nutrition science, and psychology. The Chemistry and Physics department offers organic chemistry, physical chemistry, astronomy, engineering mechanics, and electronics.[42]<br /><br />Although Stuyvesant is primarily known for its math and science focus, the school also has a comprehensive humanities program, offering students courses in British and classical literature, Shakespearean literature, science fiction, philosophy, existentialism, debate, acting, journalism, creative writing, and poetry. The history core requires two years of global history (or one year of global followed by one year of European history), one year of American history, as well as a semester each of economics and government. Humanities electives include American foreign policy, civil and criminal law, prejudice and persecution, race, ethnicity and gender issues, small business management, and Wall Street.<br /><br />Stuyvesant entered into an agreement with City College of New York in 2004, in which the college funds advanced after-school courses that are taken for college credit but taught by Stuyvesant teachers. Some of these courses include physical chemistry, linear algebra, advanced Euclidean geometry, and women's history.[46][47] Before the 2005 revision of the SAT, Stuyvesant graduates had an average score of 1408 out of 1600 (685 verbal, 723 math).[20] In 2010, the average score on the SAT for Stuyvesant students was 2087 out of 2400, or 674, 735, and 678 on the Reading, Math and Writing sections, respectively.[48] Stuyvesant also was the high school with the highest number of Advanced Placement exams taken, and also the highest number of students reaching the mastery level.[49]<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-74428369353472148922013-11-20T15:21:07.563-08:002013-11-20T15:21:07.563-08:00Sometimes I wonder if you bother to read the comme...Sometimes I wonder if you bother to read the comments. I NEVER said to close Lowell. The district has developed too far in one direction to allow that to happen all these years later. It would have been better had they never opted to have an academic magnet school, in my opinion. But that doesn't mean we should close it now. Nor do I think that donations should be districtwide. Just because I said wealthy parents are going to donate to the school just like the others, doesn't mean I am advocating a districtwide donation policy. Absolutely not. It is an infringement on a person's rights to limit donations in that manner.<br /><br />I've never met anyone who can misconstrue ideas as you can. You talk about "the good of society", but how does Lowell help the rest of San Francisco public school society? You talk about society in meaningless platitudes. If you really wanted to help our local society, our SFUSD kids, you would send your own children to schools where they would provide the kinds of influence you claim makes for a more diverse and tolerant community. But you don't. <br /><br />I wanted my son to go to Wash or LIncoln if not private. He wanted Lowell, not me. My other son goes to a very diverse school that is kind of far from my house. There's a lot of behavioral issues and classroom disruptions which makes it hard on him due to ADHD. There are a lot of kids with major issues, but he's surviving and doing well and I think it will make him a better and stronger person. And my son , who is a hardworking dedicated student, provides the kind of influence that some of the other kids need to have modeled for them. But there's no way that he will be going to Lowell because it is absolutely the wrong kind of school for him.<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-74564815461111735982013-11-20T14:40:33.649-08:002013-11-20T14:40:33.649-08:00I think it's OK to segregate by merit if you g...I think it's OK to segregate by merit if you give a chance to all, but not by income. <br /><br />Do you propose we pool all PTA funds? Or a percentage thereof? A share tax?<br /><br />I'd love to see every elementary and middle school have a balance.<br /><br />We are a misanthropic society. Most people fear the unknown. I think by integrating, you get to know them, but not with a gun to their head, as people with their own rights and values. When you have a few scholarship cases, they are afraid.<br /><br />Burke is a perfect example, 4% black and Latino combined and half those adopted by white parents. All horrified if they offend the rich white rulers they'll be expelled. It's not a place of equality.<br /><br />So your idea is to close Lowell, but I'd guess half the kids there would move or go private. I wish that weren't the case.<br /><br />If all parents agreed before the lottery to stick it out, it would cause integration, but they don't, and they wouldn't. So it would add to segregation. If everyone at Lowell did fan out, it could help, but maybe some leave, and maybe even some Lincoln, Washington and SOTA kids whose parents hoped they'd be able to get into Lowell would leave. It's all very hard to predict.<br /><br />They may just drive all but the ruling class out of SF soon anyways. The Pacific Heights crowd really loves the view and the restaurants but they consider the poor or even middle class an inconvenience to avoid.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-77980337802896418052013-11-20T13:16:04.726-08:002013-11-20T13:16:04.726-08:00How can you make this case about creaming off the ...How can you make this case about creaming off the richest when you advocate creaming off the best? Are you really going to look me in the proverbial eye and tell me about the negative effects of private school on society when you encourage and continually beat the drum to increase academic segregation at Lowell which results in removing the highest performers from San Francisco high school society, the very idea of which you claim high-mindedly to be appalling and racist?<br /><br />I know you will say that creaming off rich people is different than creaming high performers, but if you had those wealthy patrons do you think they'd be donating to SFUSD? No, they'd be donating to Lowell. How is that suppose to help public education other than your one preferred school?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-2117050001608480002013-11-20T12:35:14.520-08:002013-11-20T12:35:14.520-08:00Think about the effect this has on society, if it ...Think about the effect this has on society, if it had not cost 40k...you end up creaming off the richest people, which is class segregation, which I believe is wrong. <br /><br />As for bands 2 and 3 I would get rid of them and not consider grades either. I would base it all on testing with maybe a small nod to extracurriculars and true adversity, but not as much as now. I think a 3.5 GPA should be a minimum. <br /><br />I think Bands 2 and 3 the way they do them now are just silly. How does a principal decide who to let in? Someone who donates to PTSA and goes to meetings? Someone who is like them somehow? Underrepresented is sillier, with Hamlin and Burke alongside Visitacion Valley and MLK as underrepresented, implying disadvantaged, and Roosevelt and Aptos, schools with significant public housing and free and reduced lunch populations, as advantaged.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-2031403850882446232013-11-20T09:59:22.087-08:002013-11-20T09:59:22.087-08:00The point of this post was to highlight the fact t...The point of this post was to highlight the fact that removing the best and brightest is not helpful to the rest of public high school education in San Francisco. (As I pointed out that doesn't mean I advocate closing Lowell. A lot of circumstances would have to change.) <br /><br />If you put all the highest achieving computer engineers at one computer company how would that affect the rest of the industry? Just saying. Lowell is a great school, but it is hard to make a case for creaming off the prize animals from the rest of the livestock if you want to a healthy gene pool. Public education, I believe, should be egalitarian in philosophy and in practice. (That's fodder for our resident socialist commenter.) Privates do not have to be because they aren't publicly funded ( the public research grant issues withstanding). <br /><br />Response to BF Skinner: How do you know Lowell has more pride and what if it does? Have you conducted a study on school pride in San Francisco? Does it really matter? And how do you measure pride? For a person who loves to assign a number to assess an individual, you might want to come up with a pride index. <br /><br />More class offerings is fine but hardly the best measure of a school's quality. You fault privates for having some lower GPA students, but so does Lowell and you have already made a case that grades are a dubious metric given their subjectivity. You fault those privates for academic diversity, but give Lowell Band 2 and 3 a pass for the same. That's called bias.<br /><br />I don't get your point about how people viewing private school students as privileged. Does that matter? Why is that important? <br /><br />Do you know anything about what is actually happening at Lick, UHS, and other private high schools? My sense is that you don't. We toured and researched these schools so at least I have a first hand knowledge. We had a choice between those schools and Lowell and had it not cost about $40K a year I would have leaned to private. The amount of individual attention is something that Lowell can't compete with. And in the end, because my son happens to be a self-starter, it worked out fine. But what you fail to grasp, IMHO, is that not all kids have the specific traits that make for success at a school of the size and character of Lowell. <br /><br /><br />One last afterthought - I've attended several cross country track meets where Lowell absolutely dominates, and I have nothing but the utmost respect for the team. But I also look at the other teams and I feel a great sense of community pride the way some of these ragtag and diminutive teams compete against a far more dominant opponent. Those kids are winners in my mind and they are the stronger for their efforts in the face of the odds. I think it is metaphor in general for their experiences at some of these lesser-prized high schools. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-47891557088447225712013-11-20T05:08:47.342-08:002013-11-20T05:08:47.342-08:00Lowell kids are some of the most greedy, self-cent...Lowell kids are some of the most greedy, self-centered, self-obsessed, unaware, stressed out, rude, and arrogant kids anywhere who could care less about anyone else. They're worse than private school kids because they think they earned it. They're pushed into a life of extreme depravation and most get good grades but become so anti-social they never marry. Enjoy bragging about your perfect Lowell brats while it lasts, they won't be giving you any grandchildren because they are so narrow they have no social skills and will never go on a date. They're unaware of kids suffering they were often in school with a few months before, oblivious, think the world is perfect, and need a good slap. I would close it down. What is it about black and Chicano children you people are so afraid of? White guilt? Knowing who you enslaved and robbed? It seems the last thing in the world any of you snobs want is for your kids to go to, say, Mission, or Lincoln, or anywhere that isn't a mix of white rulers and fawning Asian wannabes! The parents worried about Lowell are just evil, I can't stand them. Some of them ask for conferences even though their kid has straight As. What a waste of resources! You have no idea how little time I have and spending an hour with a 4th grader's mom asking if little Choo Ling Fok Yoo is on track for Lowell is about the most ridiculous thing I've ever done. They don't count 4th grade Chung Fang, take a chill pill! Ask your child if they are happy. Look at their paintings, get them a psychiatrist, theyr'e going to need it. I pity your son if he wanted to go there but based on your right wing rants I'm not at all surprised. Greed is good, let's all go to Lowell and oppress the poor! It's good for them, oh so good! Ludicrous!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-17821901479630079162013-11-20T01:29:51.267-08:002013-11-20T01:29:51.267-08:00Lowell is bigger and has way more offerings of AP ...Lowell is bigger and has way more offerings of AP classes. Also, you have more pride there, people will think you are a smart and hard working student. At private high schools, some are hard to get into, but none are as hard as Lowell. They all have some kids with a 3.25 or 3.5. That doesn't get you into Lowell unless you are in public housing or a victim of society in some way. You can barely get a B in 3 semesters. You have to think ahead. You have to work super hard. You are seen as priveleged more than smart to go to Marin Day, University, Lick or Urban. All have lower standards.<br /><br />I agree they are better in terms of class size and forcing students to participate. You know people better though have less chance to choose your friends or clique due to low populations. I think Lowell is better overall because you're seen as self-made, they have way better sports and broader arts and they have more clubs and more of a variety of AP Classes. You can't predict what your child will be interested at 13 or 14. Lowell is in the top 2 high schools in the world in the number and variety of AP classes offered.<br /><br />If you know 100% you want the standard classes and don't mind being viewed as a silver spoon/priveleged type, something which ends up mattering in very liberal Universities, go for the privates.<br /><br />These are the opinions. And they are disputed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-44752546463933098462013-11-20T00:52:20.712-08:002013-11-20T00:52:20.712-08:00Changing Lowell admissions to suit a diversity or ...Changing Lowell admissions to suit a diversity or equity agenda will lower achievement in the District, in my opinion. <br /><br />All the discussion about student pressure, different ways of learning, etc. are separate issues and not exclusive to Lowell.<br /><br />Instead of diluting top achievers to other schools (and, in my opinion, losing a fair number to Private or other districts) I would suggest we look to narrow the gap between Lowell and other SFUSD highschools by improving the other schools. Call me radical.<br /><br />Yes, I am beating the drum for instilling a mandate for greater academic proficiency, but it's all I've got for this topic right now. Oh, and maybe sprinkle in some specialty classes to capture student interests, expand horizons, and address different ways of learning.<br /><br />Don, I appreciate that you post on a variety topics - I am becoming better informed. And I appreciate that you have given wide latitude in the comments, it sharpens my thinking and keeps me vigilant when I see radical comments. I say accept it, moderate it, but don't waste your time responding to it.ABnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-58319824056163078022013-11-19T23:22:39.233-08:002013-11-19T23:22:39.233-08:00Lowell is a great school for a public school. I be...Lowell is a great school for a public school. I believe there to be several better private high schools in the city.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-28262947909144878352013-11-19T19:32:21.340-08:002013-11-19T19:32:21.340-08:00Lady, I find your insults kind of charming. But I...Lady, I find your insults kind of charming. But I'm a little confused. First you said I was spot on with the post. Now I'm greedy? Didn't quite catch on to how greed applies. <br /><br />As for Pavlov, I would say this - if you can only say the same things over and over maybe it's time to stop talking.<br /><br />And as for Lowell, it's a great school in many ways, but it's not for every kid. Some kids will do much better outside of such a cutthroat environment. Some kids need the nurturing. Others have the independence to make it at Lowell. And you do need to be independent because no one is going to hold your hand. But my kid wanted to go there. I actually encouraged him to look around more at other options. <br /><br />Just because a critical mass of high performing students attend doesn't mean that you can't get at least as good an education elsewhere. What really makes any school great is a critical mass of inspired teachers. Being surrounded by good students is important but teachers are the key. And from what I understand Lowell has both the inspired and the uninspired as does any public school. <br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-89019984004504690572013-11-19T17:23:00.397-08:002013-11-19T17:23:00.397-08:00Your basic philosophy is greed is good and so is D...Your basic philosophy is greed is good and so is Don's. I say phooey on the two of you and all of you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-59576864326455206002013-11-19T15:11:39.974-08:002013-11-19T15:11:39.974-08:00Too many deletions! It was getting interesting. ...Too many deletions! It was getting interesting. Some were not violating rules.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-30187116662398261282013-11-19T14:09:30.046-08:002013-11-19T14:09:30.046-08:00Don, I'm sorry I have a basic philosophy. I t...Don, I'm sorry I have a basic philosophy. I think if you analyze it closely you do to. I don't have a new thing to say about each issue, my IQ isn't 170, I'm not Bill Clinton. Every issue will come down to a few beliefs, children are capable of a lot more than most Americans give them credit for, we should have neighborhood schools, we need to think outside the box and have more tutoring, we need to encourage kids to study more, you get out what you put in. I may have a few more thoughts, but expecting me to never talk about what I think the crux of the problem is because I said it before is just going to make it impossible for me to comment on this blow due to a fear of censorship. I think most people have a few opinions and repeat themself, you, me, AB, Moggy, Laurie, Fred, Sandra Fewer, Noteacher, Eric Mar, Geoffrey Canada, Michelle Rhee, etc. There were school board candidates with thousands of signs up who said nothing more than "I'm a parent running for school board." I think you're too hard on me expecting a new opinion. I read 5 education books a year, I try, but I don't always have a new, well thought-out opinion on every subject. Most philosophies repeat themself over time. If you want it to get broader, we need to get more people on here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-4308508447788608342013-11-19T13:42:24.145-08:002013-11-19T13:42:24.145-08:00Don, Democrats will win every election and become ...Don, Democrats will win every election and become more and more liberal. Clawing, with fingernails? Yes, this is apt. I see kids scratched and beaten by parents. I have kids who start shaking and become physically afraid when they get a B. This is worse in middle school. Beating kids to make them "smarter" is not the kind of America I want to live in. That's not parenting. That's abuse! It is a scourge, all this competitive obsessive hatred. Clawing children because they get a B. I don't tolerate it. And children don't need to be pressured. All children should develop at their own pace.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-54225382074293487832013-11-19T13:41:04.042-08:002013-11-19T13:41:04.042-08:00It is impossible to run a blog if the moderator al...It is impossible to run a blog if the moderator allows the conversation to be hijacked.<br /><br />If you call people racist I will delete the comment. If you post off topic I will delete the comment. I don't want to but you people don't listen or follow the rules, yet you tell everyone else the rules to success. But mostly I'm just tired of being bored to death with the same repetitive commentary. I got the point already - long ago. <br /><br />One person is clinging to behaviorism. He molds his children to become who he wants them to become. The other person let's them be whomever they are and makes no attempt to help them to fulfill their potential. <br /><br />Does anyone have anything else to say that hey haven't already said? <br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14747706639487714496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-65277302888018380212013-11-19T12:50:19.519-08:002013-11-19T12:50:19.519-08:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-59014261982253553592013-11-19T12:48:29.003-08:002013-11-19T12:48:29.003-08:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7589033419847538727.post-80732331265351541362013-11-19T12:42:31.409-08:002013-11-19T12:42:31.409-08:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com